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Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time

Posted by: Dan Frederiksen - Wed May 05, 2010 2:57 pm
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Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time 
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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Tue May 18, 2010 10:19 pm
Lourens, I guess we are done then.
just for the record the max power is just for peak acceleration. it is of course not a sustained effort. a tesla roadster has a 170kW or so rating yet if it ran at that powerlevel the batteries wouldn't last 20 minutes.
yet it has a 400+km range at 80km/h.
it's a peak power level, rarely used. that should bepossible to understand.

and a 400HP ferrari puts out a megawatt of heat when running full power.
you are stupid because you choose to be.


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Tue May 18, 2010 11:00 pm
Ok, first off...Lourens, that was pure awesome, and so full of snarky, yet subtle win. In addition to that you've actually run some numbers (more than I and ESPESCIALLY more than Dan has done) and for that alone you deserve respect.
The fact that he no longer wants to talk to you is pure gold and to me, a sign that he is furiously backpedaling in the hopes of trying to find solid ground again.

@SANEAlex: Thanks for that link, I'll have to look into it later. As for the super caps, I've been thinking, instead of using them in place of batteries, use them in conjunction. i.e. for boosting current on demand (like when accelerating) without putting heavier loads on the batteries, and trickle charging them until they are needed again. *shrugs* honestly don't see why this wouldn't work, especially when coupled with solar panel, regen braking, and/or a small generator.

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
you are stupid because you choose to be.

I was trying to think of a witty reply to this.... but yeah... I'd rather discuss these things with true intellectuals...soooo...... shoo. go away. begone and all that good stuff.


to everyone else: I do appologize for being an ass, and will endeavour to be less like Dan (i.e. a punk and a fool) :P


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Wed May 19, 2010 1:29 am
MFL wrote:
@SANEAlex: Thanks for that link, I'll have to look into it later. As for the super caps, I've been thinking, instead of using them in place of batteries, use them in conjunction. i.e. for boosting current on demand (like when accelerating) without putting heavier loads on the batteries, and trickle charging them until they are needed again. *shrugs* honestly don't see why this wouldn't work, especially when coupled with solar panel, regen braking, and/or a small generator.


I think that the New Scientist did a better article on the making of fuel using zirconia but as Geoffrey Landis as well as writing sci fi also worked on the spirit and opportunity mar missions i thought his site would be an appropriate link for this site. After rereading this thread i must admit i had mostly skimmed it before have you also considered counter rotating flywheels as short term storage for your electric truck they might be viable on a larger vehicle the technology is being developed for Uninterpretable Power supplies and if you had two going in opposite directions it should counteract gyroscopic problems.

The other thing is as far as i can make out that you have all been doing calculations on DC motors well one of the originally tinfoil hat conspiracies that turn out to be true was General Motors suppression of EV technologies after it had managed to buy enough politicians (legitimate tax deductible lobbying of course :evil: ) to reduce the strength of California's clean air laws. Well before they went to the dark side i was a supporter following the Impact technologies and thought how well done they were, the two best i recall were they designed from scratch so it was aerodynamic above and below(no need of transmission and exhaust underneath breaking up air flow) but the big one was that they were using more efficient AC Motors and had come up with a ninety plus percent inverter to convert DC to AC so that there were efficiency gains even with the small conversion losses. I don't know if they are using this tech in the new models they are being forced to make now that they are a publicly owned company propped up by American tax payers but it may be possible to license it if they haven't managed to really tinfoil hat suppress it :twisted:

Who killed the electric car is worth a watch if you can get hold of a copy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Killed ... ric_Car%3F
I personally think that GM should have been left to crash and burn after what they did and not been propped back up. I don't think they killed the electric car but i suspect we would further along if the money spent "lobbying" had been spent developing the tech instead.

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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Wed May 19, 2010 1:10 pm
Well, of all the Baillouts, GM was a much better buy than the 700+ billion dropped into Wallstreet. GM has paid back that money already. Wallstreet (those companies that were bailed) haven't. not to mention the big bonuses and hugely expensive company retreats that AIG and the like took with that bailout money. Those companies should definitely been left to die.

One of the problems with GM is the American public. As soon as the gas prices started to drop even a little again, the demand for SUVs and Trucks jumped up again. We scream and holler for better fuel prices, but can't part with the idea of not having a Sports Useless Vehicle to bogart the parking lots and highways with. Everyone points the finger at GM saying they aren't producing the right vehicle, when in reality, the finger should be pointed at the buyers, who arent demanding the right vehicle. the UAW didn't help matters before either.


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Wed May 19, 2010 5:56 pm
Dear Dan

I once bashed a space tourism firm in an exchange of emails with one of the founders. That was over ten years ago when I was about 17. I have grown up a lot since and am ashamed of the stuff I said. :oops:
I suggest you grow up as well. Even though you are 35 years old, it is never too late.

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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Wed May 19, 2010 6:53 pm
MFL wrote:
Everyone points the finger at GM saying they aren't producing the right vehicle, when in reality, the finger should be pointed at the buyers, who arent demanding the right vehicle. the UAW didn't help matters before either.


Good point. GM produces what will bring a profit, as they should. But . . . nothing personal, but who are you to tell people what they should buy and what they shouldn't?

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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Wed May 19, 2010 8:46 pm
Dan Frederiksen wrote:
Lourens, I guess we are done then.

If you say so. I do a lot of long distance running, I have plenty of stamina, and I'm not afraid of a little opposition. But I won't hold it against you if your batteries are running out.

Quote:
just for the record the max power is just for peak acceleration. it is of course not a sustained effort. a tesla roadster has a 170kW or so rating yet if it ran at that powerlevel the batteries wouldn't last 20 minutes.
yet it has a 400+km range at 80km/h.
it's a peak power level, rarely used. that should bepossible to understand.

But all the scenarios I worked out were for longer duration loads, like driving to work or to the supermarket. So, it wouldn't be correct to use the maximum peak power there, you have to use the maximum sustained power. Which I did. I do not see why you would get so upset about me trying to keep your car from catching fire.

Now, if the Freeranger was designed for drag racing, then I would have used the maximum peak power, since the run time is so short. But you are designing it as a car for the masses. The masses don't race down drag strips, they go to work and to the supermarket. They are not particularly interested in more effective ways of rear-ending the car in front of them at the traffic light.

Quote:
and a 400HP ferrari puts out a megawatt of heat when running full power.

I'm sure it does. It also has a big powerful radiator to dissipate all that heat, and combustion engines lose heat with the exhaust gases, which an electrical motor doesn't. That, and it having enough structure to hold together under the required loads, (Ever seen a professional cycling crash on TV? Those big narrow carbon fibre wheels sure fold easily if you load them sideways. Like when cornering at speed in the Freeranger.), make it weigh almost a ton and a half though. Its fuel economy is a lot worse than the Freeranger as well. The Freeranger is not a Ferrari Dan ;).

Quote:
I am not wrong Lourens
[...]
and I know what I'm talking about. please don't indulge urges to kneejerk object to the things I've said.
[...]
that's just you still resisting the idea without reason
[...]
Lourens, sigh
[...]
I'm not going to answer you again unless you own up and stop your massive mistakes.
[...]
when I say electric drive is superior then it is so. I have spent 3½ years thinking about environmental car tech and I am rather intelligent.
[...]
Lourens, when I say it has 80hp then please don't say it has 16. it's that kind of continued intentional mistakes that make me not want to answer you.
[...]
take the time to understand what I say. listen to me, not your prejudice.
[...]
I am right about the car, cars in general and I am right about what AA should do. it would be amazing but it's like talking to a wall. you move so slowly. you think so little
[...]
you are stupid because you choose to be.

I have to admit to being slightly sarcastic now and then, yes. What can I say, I'm not perfect like you.

The above condescending comments are interesting things to say though, about someone whose degree trumps yours (I have an MSc in Computer Science, with honours, without needing a second go at it, and in fact without ever failing an exam), who wrecked the curve in every class he's been in (and then there was that year in fourth grade of secondary school where they were doing mechanics in physics class, and he scored 10/10 on every single test), who got a prize for promising young engineering students (top 5 of his field, of several hundred eligible students nationwide) after his first year at university, who is currently the lead software architect of an information system to support various parts of the Dutch government with better ecological data, and who is about to start working on a PhD thesis in ecology e-Science.

If it makes you feel any better, I also took some ballroom dancing classes once, and I sucked quite badly. Pretty much the only thing I was any good at there was the twist.

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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Wed May 19, 2010 11:20 pm
Lourens, what good is your mind if you don't honestly use it.
I don't stop debating you because I'm too tired. I stop because I can see your spirit so clearly that you have no hope of becoming reasonable. I have extensive experience talking to people just like you who mindlessly oppose deviation from status quo. who hasn't dared to think on his own for even a second of his life.
some who do well in school, some even at extraordinarily young age, fade away when they become adults. many of them have no independent thought and only in the framework of school do they do well. most humans commit intellectual suicide at age 20 and surrender to death because they believe the whispered lie that there is nothing they can do. they trade intellectual growth for rest in pussy. and in that death some come to hate those who don't surrender. others cowardly admire.

I am absolutely right about AA, I'm right about cars and I'm right about you. I am also right when I say you can change if you choose to but I'm afraid the odds of you doing so are bad.
It is a spiritual game this life. I am great because I love the truth. I seek it, I take it irrespective of discomfort. I don't let my mind be clouded because of perceived offense nor any fickle mindset. I bow to truth and I worship it and that elevates me incomparably above you. That is why I see clearly and make so few mistakes. Anyone can do it. few do.

Verily I say that the course AA has charted shall not change this world but even cement its stagnation in that it fortifies the lie that noone can do anything if even the great John Carmack fails. 20 years of AA and nothing of Nasa's corrupt incompetent stagnation will have been challenged, even if they get to bouncing turists.
And your mind is so fickle (as you let it) that even in 10 years when I am proven right you will not have learned from it. You will not even think about it and if prompted you will say they tried their best and it couldn't have been done better.
You fail because you don't try.

mikethespaceman, I'm 34 and I'm more adult than you can understand. You have no idea what you are or what this reality is. Things are not what they appear to be.

Make a robot feel pain. That is the red pill but none of you will choose it.


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 12:07 am
SuperShuki wrote:

Good point. GM produces what will bring a profit, as they should. But . . . nothing personal, but who are you to tell people what they should buy and what they shouldn't?
Don't get me wrong, I wasn't trying to imply that i think like Dan, in that the people should have a car shoved down their throats because it is 'good' for them. I was just commenting on how I hear a lot of people complain about "oh, GM doesn't build anything that the people want' or 'Oh, the big three never build cars good for the environment' and then turn around and buy and Escalade or a Hummer (or worse a Prius, yes, they do more environmental damage to the environment than the average hummer, but that's a different topic :smile: ). I dunno, the fickle opinion of the public always leaves me with my palm impacting my forehead, but hey, what's the point of freedom if you can't express your right to choose, no? It's one of those things... I may not like a lot of the decisions that people make, but I'll defend their right to make them.

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
Verily I say
FORSOOTH!!! For the man doth say verily that he be in the truth and that the truth doth flow from him like flames. And lo, do I say unto thee, open thine eyes that they may be burned as by the flatulence brought on by three been burrito with extra cheese and volcano sauce from Taco Bell. Hark! As the musical words of his tribulations flow forth like the raucous breeze from a swine's buttocks.

ok... that was..... out there, even for me. but that was fun :) and i'm out of Old English snark... need to go back and re-read some Shakespeare... or better... Cyrano de Bergerac... oooo that was a good one.


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 12:20 am
Hmmm this outta be good. Hit him MFL!!


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 1:41 am
I'm sorry Dan, but, reading your posts, all I see is a lot of frustration and a lack of knowledge of Aerospace issues. I feel you man, I used to be like that, I freely admit it (I meant venting for my lack of success by trolling bulletin boards, not lack of knowledge of Aerospace Engineering, in which I hold two degrees and working on a third) .Luckily for me life has thrown me around a bit, in both good and bad ways, and made me realize that you are what you make of yourself. Nothing more, nothing less. If you feel like bashing Armadillo, build a better rocket first.

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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 3:06 am
mike, even if I were to accept the premise that you can't encourage others to do better and you have to do everything on your own (quite a few professions I would have to master and hold btw) then where would I get the millions of dollars to do it? humm?

perhaps you didn't quite think it through.

John has the means, the opportunity, the partial inclination and the skill. It is a unique opportunity to massively improve this world for all mankind.
So great is the opportunity that I would expect to see great opposition from official elements whose business can't handle public scrutiny and if it couldn't be stopped I wouldn't be surprised if John would be killed to stop it. not that you would understand what's at stake.


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 8:13 am
Dan Frederiksen wrote:
I'm 34 and I'm more adult than you can understand. You have no idea what you are or what this reality is. Things are not what they appear to be.


Good Grief. I thought he was about 17 given his attitude and obviously incomplete understanding on how the world works. I'm sure I was like that (well, actually, never that bad) when I was about 17, before I actually understood stuff. However,that was before the internet, so I never had the facility to make a fool of myself in front of the whole world!

Anyone who has to result to the condescension and nonsense that Dan produces really should still be at school.

Oh, and btw, I too am a genius, with better ideas than the whole of the aerospace and car industry. I am absolutely sure that I can produce a better rocket system, better cars, and provide the world with clean unlimited energy and food. I just cannot get the funding, or persuade the incumbents to accept my ideas as so much better than theirs. I really don't know why they are such morons, given that my ideas are so good. Weird. They really are so completely stupid not to bow down before my intellect. So, I'm going to keep posting on these sorts of boards until somebody pays me the attention that I deserve. I'm sure these idiots will start to get it soon.

[Please note to anyone reading, the above paragraph is meant as satire, and does not represent the views of the person posting]


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 2:18 pm
Quote:
John has the means, the opportunity, the partial inclination and the skill.


Dan, John worked to earn his money. It is his money, and he can spend it however he likes. Please explain to me again why you don't have the means? You're a genius, you know better than everyone else, so why is it that you don't have any extra money to invest in your EV project? If you actually wrote the software to render the graphics on your web page, you could start by improving it and selling copies of it online for a few euros. Use that money to fund your car. Oh wait, you don't have the inclination to do that. Is it that your only inclination is to complain about how the world isn't what you want it to be.
In the words of Mahatma Gandhi, "Be the change you want to see". Stop complaining and actively do something real. Complaining on this forum accomplishes nothing. Unless you're actively working to change things, you're just one of us "sheep".


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Post Re: Do we live forever that we can afford to waste time   Posted on: Thu May 20, 2010 3:10 pm
fatron, Ghandhi did little more than suggest things could be better. some of his most effective actions was to do exactly nothing, not even eat.
he was righteous and he met much resistance to his ideas and many who would prefer that he shut up, even plot to kill him. and he was indeed assassinated like most great men. So rare is righteousness and so great is the resistance to sanity in this world. Just as you resist what I say.

as for money, I might well commercialize my renderer for the money but I do so reluctantly because I hate wasting my mind on capitalism and that devotion is what has allowed me to realize things few others see and even a couple of things that many have tried for but noone succeeded at.

as for John, it is indeed his choice. I have said before he is not obligated to do anything, but I would like him to at least realize that if he does not go for the brass ring then it is just a hobby endeavor that will never have impact and should no longer be styled as a people's rebellion against Nasa as is currently the stated purpose for AA's existence even though it was never really a conscious purpose nor likely with appreciation of the massive scope of what's at stake. they have impression that nasa could do better but haven't taken the time to be conscious about just how grand the betrayal is.


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