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Potential RRL Altitude Attempt (Split from Q&A)

Posted by: Dan Frederiksen - Wed May 05, 2010 2:38 pm
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Potential RRL Altitude Attempt (Split from Q&A) 
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Post Potential RRL Altitude Attempt (Split from Q&A)   Posted on: Wed May 05, 2010 2:38 pm
how high could the current RRL racers go if pointed straight up and pulsed with some aerodynamically optimal thrust policy?
worth a shot?


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Wed May 05, 2010 3:03 pm
I believe that the current Racers have a thrust to weight ratio of less than 1. They can climb fairly steeply however. I have not heard how high they can get.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Thu May 06, 2010 1:37 am
I think that the existing engines have about 2500 lbf of thrust and the Velocity XL weighs about 2900 lb before rocket modification.

The new rocket racer also has no passenger accommodation, and it isn't pressurized, so it has a useful ceiling of about 4 km. With oxygen masks, maybe 7 km. It's not very suitable for altitude records or space tourism.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Sun May 09, 2010 12:05 pm
hmm I see. so a jet engine could substantially outperform it.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 8:03 am
Yes, as could a top spec aerobatic IC engine and propeller I imagine.

Although I don't think that is the point.

I think I remember reading that the test pilot was very impressed by the thrust at takeoff. I presume you get full power straight away with rocket, unlike the jet or prop plane.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 12:42 pm
there is no point to the rocket racing. it is ill conceived and a waste of everyone's lives.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 2:08 pm
Actually there is a point, you just have too narrow a viewpoint to see it.
I take it you also think that F1 racing, NASCAR, international soccer leagues, the Olympics, and other major sports etc are equally a waste of everyone's lives.

the point of RRL is entertainment. And typically any form of entertainment centered around an impressive skill set will genereate money. Where do you think some of that money goes? back to the engine builders: Armadillo.

the RRL would also generate a much needed interest in rocketry and aeronautics, enticeing children to want to learn more about how they work, and make them more want to go into the Science, Math, and Engineering fields.

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
hmm I see. so a jet engine could substantially outperform it.
That depends highly on the performance envelope you are looking at. Wouldn't be the least bit surprised if these RR planes could easily out accelerate any piston or turbine aircraft. that and the engine is only one contributing factor to an aircrafts performance envelope.

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
there is no point to the rocket racing. it is ill conceived and a waste of everyone's lives.
I honestly can't believe you are so dense to actually believe this, and are truly just trying to Troll.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 3:29 pm
MFL, I am incomparably smarter and more thoughtful than you.
you are so thoughtless that your overriding motivation was a misguided attempt to score brown nose points by defending AA against criticism. you never thought even for a second about the actual truth of any aspect of the matter.
I am a genius and I am right in my observations and even your soul would jump for joy if John woke up and did as I suggest. It would be incomparably better than the current direction. I wouldn't be surprised if just the mere declaration of the intent would yield substantial progress in the form of official objections because those who live in darkness are angered by the idea of shedding light and they would likely show their true colors.
If John actually pursued this and wouldn't surrender to pressure I wouldn't be surprised if John would die in an 'accident'.
You sheepish children have no idea of how this world really works. how wicked incompetent people usurp power. and you never will unless you start seeking the truth.

in the words of John F Kennedy (my fellow troll and tinfoil hat bearer) in a speech he gave in april 1961, not too long before he was assassinated:
"The very word "secrecy" is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and secret proceedings. We decided long ago that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinent facts far outweighed the dangers which are cited to justify it. Even today, there is little value in opposing the threat of a closed society by imitating its arbitrary restrictions. Even today, there is little value in insuring the survival of our nation if our traditions do not survive with it. And there is very grave danger that an announced need for increased security will be seized upon those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment. That I do not intend to permit to the extent that it is in my control. And no official of my Administration, whether his rank is high or low, civilian or military, should interpret my words here tonight as an excuse to censor the news, to stifle dissent, to cover up our mistakes or to withhold from the press and the public the facts they deserve to know.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy that relies primarily on covert means for expanding its sphere of influence - on infiltration instead of invasion, on subversion instead of elections, on intimidation instead of free choice, on guerrillas by night instead of armies by day. It is a system which has conscripted vast human and material resources into the building of a tightly knit, highly efficient machine that combines military, diplomatic, intelligence, economic, scientific and political operations.
Its preparations are concealed, not published. Its mistakes are buried not headlined. Its dissenters are silenced, not praised. No expenditure is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed."

you can listen to the full speech here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXKzKrIrg1s

and the words of Eisenhower, january 1961:
"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.
Akin to, and largely responsible for the sweeping changes in our industrial-military posture, has been the technological revolution during recent decades. In this revolution, research has become central, it also becomes more formalized, complex, and costly. A steadily increasing share is conducted for, by, or at the direction of, the Federal government.
Today, the solitary inventor, tinkering in his shop, has been overshadowed by task forces of scientists in laboratories and testing fields. In the same fashion, the free university, historically the fountainhead of free ideas and scientific discovery, has experienced a revolution in the conduct of research. Partly because of the huge costs involved, a government contract becomes virtually a substitute for intellectual curiosity. For every old blackboard there are now hundreds of new electronic computers. The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present -- and is gravely to be regarded."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y06NSBBRtY


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 3:54 pm
we have no concept of how the world really works?
you mean like you? you obviously have almost no knowledge of engineering or engineering processes, science, or economics. You apparently can read minds, and are the foremost expert on the secret governments and societies of this world...

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
you are so thoughtless that your overriding motivation was a misguided attempt to score brown nose points by defending AA against criticism. you never thought even for a second about the actual truth of any aspect of the matter.
brown nose points? hardly. Defending against criticism? no... just commenting on your narrow mindedness and blatent stupidity.
Dan Frederiksen wrote:
I am a genius and I am right in my observations and even your soul would jump for joy if John woke up and did as I suggest.
A genius by what standards? medieval europe? Your observations are completely off base, fueled by your paranoid delusions with no foundations in reality.

Again I say to you, if you are such a genius as you so claim,PUT UP OR SHUT UP.
What have you done to further the course of science and society other than troll the interwebs from your basement? My Guess? nothing. Nada. Zip, Zero Zilch. And you probably never will. You claim to be smarter, but your posts on these threads deffinitly do not show this. Anyone with any sense of intelligence would not berate and spew uninformed nonsense at those he is trying to convince to change.

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
MFL, I am incomparably smarter and more thoughtful than you.
LMFAO.... Dan-O you are a hoot sometimes.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 5:32 pm
Dan Frederiksen wrote:
MFL, I am incomparably smarter and more thoughtful than you.
you are so thoughtless that your overriding motivation was a misguided attempt to score brown nose points by defending AA against criticism. you never thought even for a second about the actual truth of any aspect of the matter.
I am a genius and I am right in my observations


And here we go again....

]


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 8:53 pm
It seems to me that this is completely off-topic for the Official Armadillo Q&A thread.

so - Stop trying to hijacking this thread.

If anyone wants to vent, troll or pontificate in these forums, they need only start a new thread - and the vast majority of us who are interested in Armadillo Aerospace and their progress can then go about their business without wasting their time and bandwith on this nonproductive noise.

Sigurd?


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 10:15 pm
I'll be back in another 6 months or so. even though the forum seems entirely unreachable and violently opposed to the truth, I have had some succes elsewhere reaching a majority over a long time of patient exposure.
however obtuse at first, the truth does appear to have piercing power over time.
it's a shame I have to waste years of my life raising the dead when it could be heard instantly when I speak it but what can I do..

Einstein had a not so flattering quote about this type of situation. something about infinity. but he was wrong about the small decimals. it's not quite infinity. slowly you can be reached.

the tragedy is somewhat compounded by the absense of the one who needs to hear it the most. John.


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Post Re: Official Armadillo Q&A thread   Posted on: Mon May 10, 2010 10:57 pm
@Trance
I'll admit i should have fed the troll like i did...
but bigots like him really irk me.

Dan Frederiksen wrote:
it's a shame I have to waste years of my life raising the dead when it could be heard instantly when I speak it but what can I do..
bladee bladee blah.... go back under your bridge and let us progress forward instead of wasting our time listening to your whargarbl.


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Post Re: Potential RRL Altitude Attempt (Split from Q&A)   Posted on: Wed May 12, 2010 1:18 am
Topic split to keep this worthy and very interesting discussion out of the Q&A thread.

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Post Re: Potential RRL Altitude Attempt (Split from Q&A)   Posted on: Wed May 12, 2010 1:26 pm
azinyk wrote:
The new rocket racer also has no passenger accommodation, and it isn't pressurized, so it has a useful ceiling of about 4 km. With oxygen masks, maybe 7 km. It's not very suitable for altitude records or space tourism.

pressure suit :D like the sled drivers used to use.

I do agree the airframe is not really suited for altitude records, especially considering the current record for a rocket plane is the X-15 @ 107.96 km. Granted it was also dropped from a mothership and purposely built for such a task.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-15_Flight_91

If they went for an altitude record, or even a time to climb record, they may get a place for it as the vehicle takes off on its own power from the ground. Not sure what the current records are for this class of vehicle, and to be honest, i'm not sure if one's been built or operated since the ME 163 in WWII.

Crazy,crazy thought: 4 small strap-on hybrid RATO motors around the engine cowling to help preserve fuel during takeoff and initial climb. lol now THAT would be a kick in the pants.

Edited in a futile attempt to correct spelling :)


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